Good morning. Today I will ask the elders who would like to tackle a question that was raised by one of the members. The question is, is it biblical for a Christian to remarry after divorce from a spouse who has gone on to marry and start another family. So that's the topic that we are going to consider today. And before we start, I'm going to ask our supporter just to open with a word of prayer. Let's pray. Dear Father in Heaven, we come Thanking you, O God, for another day that you have provided us to worship you, to gather together with those who are your children, those who have been sent in peace to come, to honor and glorify your name. We thank you for the opportunity, O God, and do not take it for granted, our Father, that you have given us this new day. Thank you for your grace, and we recognize your mercy in doing that to us, and your favor therefore upon us. Our desire and our prayer is that this entire day, O Lord, beginning with this meeting for us, might be used in remembering, O Lord, your goodness, in reflecting and meditating, O God, upon your mercy and your grace toward us, spiritually and physically, O Lord. So we pray that you would cause our minds and our hearts to be engaged in this day in honoring and glorifying your name as you desire. Our Father, we know that we cannot do this to your pleasing unless your Holy Spirit helps us. Therefore, we ask for his presence among us this morning, and his presence among us this whole day, in our meetings, corporately, but also in individual times, as individuals or as families overall. We pray specifically now for our time together here. We pray that you would lead us. Again, we come to a time when we tackle a question or questions that are in our midst, seeking, O God, to see what you have said in your scriptures for our direction and, our Father, what you have given us in terms of wisdom. We pray, O God, for your wisdom, therefore, that we might not mislead ourselves or the congregation. but we would go into the path of the way everlasting. So help us, O God, to walk in biblical truth. Help us, O Lord, also to be amenable, to see where we are wrong, and to therefore turn and practice what is right. Pray for our moderator, pray for ourselves, pray for the congregation. Our Father be gracious to us this morning. We pray also for the family schools that are going on while we have our meeting here. We pray, O God, for you to bless, Lord, the children especially, through their teachers this morning. We ask, O God, and pray all these things in Jesus' name. Amen. To start with, I'm going to ask the elders to try and help us understand what marriage is and how it came about. What is marriage and how it came about. Good morning. We will try as much as possible to raise our voices in front of Tao don't know why. When we go back in Genesis, in chapter 2, we see that God is the one who instituted marriage, and marriage is the union of the man and the woman. And when you read Genesis, chapter 2, I think the passage that you all know, Genesis chapter 2, when we read from verse 22 to 24, we actually see the coming in together of a man and a woman and we see there were being told that therefore a man will leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife and the two become one flesh. Now already from there we see this principle of marriage, that it's God's idea. Now, what we need to be clear in our mind, that unlike what others would say marriage is a sacrament, whenever we use the term sacrament for something, it's always closed to believers. That's why baptism and the Lord's Supper as a sacrament, it's only for believers. But marriage is not a sacrament when we look at it in the Bible, meaning it's open to the rest of God's creation, whether unbelievers or believers, but it still must be done on God's terms, as we see from Genesis chapter 2. Yeah, I think I could add to that, in the sense that the marriage institution must be seen in a number of dimensions. It's a very, very important institution. One, it's primarily the foundation of human society. It's God's intention that our society progresses on the basis of families, men and women getting married according to his will, producing offspring, nurturing them, raising them up, and so human society is intended to produce, rather to proceed, to progress on the basis of this. And so it is a very, very important institution and anything that disrupts us or that disrupts this institution must necessarily demand our attention. But also it's important to note that marriage, like so many things on earth, reflects things in heaven. It's a fair reflection of things in heaven. and there are many ways in which marriage is a reflection of the covenant relationship, one that God has between himself and his people, and also the covenant relationship in heaven. There are a number of ways in which, of course, it's not the subject of this study, but there are a number of ways in which when you look carefully at this institution, It is intended to reveal God. God reveals himself through it in a very, very special way. And so anything that disturbs this institution, obviously, is something we need to pay attention to. In my introductory remarks, just like the rest, just to emphasize that this is the Lord's doing. It is His own design and plan, marriage being. And that it takes that very, very seriously. And if you read the scriptures, the marriage institution is an elevated institution. It's a very high institution. It should be honored by all. I mean, the intention is to give glory to God. That's also what I quoted from Genesis. But also, if you look at the Lord Jesus Christ in Matthew 18, that same passage, Because from that same passage, the Lord Jesus Christ also says this, have you not read from verse 4, have you not read that he who created them from the beginning made them male and female? He said, therefore man shall leave his father and his mother and hold fast his wife and two shall become one flesh. So they are no longer one, two rather, but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let not man separate. But also the Apostle Paul in Ephesians quotes that same verse, but before he does that, there's a prelude where he speaks about the husband and the wife, and how they ought to relate, and something of what others that we have spoke about, a reflection of the union of Christ with this church therefore. It's a very elevated institution, one that must not be entered into lightly, one that must be thought of very highly, one that must be honoured, and to all intents and purposes in God's eyes, one that was meant to be a permanent union until death. That was what was the intention in the Lord's eyes. So it shouldn't be something that is seen lightly. And I think it's good to emphasize that here, because a number of the questions that we'll be tackling seem to suggest in the eyes of people that the church generally, and maybe even this church and elders around, seem to view this institution lightly because of the way questions are dealt with or situations are dealt with. That's not the case. Nothing could be further from the case. The institution is regarded in extremely high light and that should be so from the scripture. We've seen that marriage is God's own idea and the intention is that the man will leave his mother and father and be glued to his wife, suggesting to us that that relationship is a permanent one until death separates the two. If we have that in our minds, what's God's attitude towards divorce then? What's God's attitude towards divorce? When you look at the scriptures and you begin with the Old Testament all the way into the New Testament, you get the idea that the Lord is not pleased when this union that we've already spoken about is broken. Because this union is pointing or it must reflect the love of God for the Church. And so there are a number of passages that God brings out clearly the fact that he's displeased when this union is broken. You have Malachi chapter 2, then you also have, I hope I remember the actual passage in Jeremiah, which after God is talking, and also Isaiah, where God is actually telling the nation of Israel of the fact that he's displeased with this fact that this bond has been broken. And now when you come With the New Testament and the law of Jesus Christ in Matthew 5, in Matthew 19, his teaching on the aspect of divorce or responding to a person He doesn't immediately answer the question of divorce but takes us back to the way it was in the beginning and basically trying to help us understand the sanctity of marriage and so Christ constantly takes his audience and takes us back to what God's initial The purpose was that this must be permanent and so when that bond is broken, God is actually displeased. Maybe I could add that the Lord does not command divorce. Wherever you look at it, He doesn't command it. His attitude to it is one of horror and sexual life. Or, as one of the passages that Pastor quoted, hate divorce. God hates divorce. So He detests it. It's abhorrent to Him. He doesn't command it. But then if you read the rest of the scriptures that align with this subject, you see that there are passages which teach that He permits it, or He allows it. And He allows it for the reason of sin and sinfulness, or the fault, the hardness, of men's hearts as we shall see in some of the scriptures. That's the reason that they're missing. It's not something that he commands. It's not something that he says should be done. In fact, he says it's something that should be avoided. He hates divorce. And his desire is that it is not there and it doesn't happen among God's people or among any people for that matter. However, it does permit it because of the sinfulness of man, because of the hardness of man's heart. Let me hasten to add also that because of this permission and because these things have been happening among us, many tend to think that the leaders of the churches and also our own church take this matter rather lightly and handle it rather lightly. Nothing could be further from the truth. In fact, what the elders seek to do is to try and portray, even in the handling of matters of divorce and even remarriage, try and portray first of all that that is not God's intention. And I also want to say, maybe by way of further introduction on the subject, that when we came to our position, individually and collectively on this matter, as a church here and as the churches around us, the Reformed Baptist churches, We took time to look at the matter seriously among ourselves, the fact that we had an elder die, because we wanted to align our thoughts together to see where each one of us was in the scripture. So we took a day and a day and a half to go through the subject and look at the many commutations and see what the scripture says. All that shows you that it was seriousness involved, especially in light of the fact that God wants permanence in marriage, He hates divorce, but it does permit it where the influence of man is clearly evident. So the attitude of God towards divorce? He hates divorce. That's the first thing. The foremost thing, he hates divorce. But because of the hardness of man's heart, he permits divorce in certain circumstances. Then we move on. Is there a place for remarriage? Are you getting me there? I think a show of hands will be able to indicate to me that you are able to hear me. Is there a place for remarriage? Is there a place for remarriage? Is there a place for remarriage? Are you able to hear me now? Okay. All right. I think... Yeah, before we go to the... to answer the place of the marriage, I think it would be good for us to be clear in our minds as in to when divorce is allowed and what are the legitimate grounds. Now, when we go back to Deuteronomy chapter 24, verse 1 to verse 4, it would be good for us to turn there Deuteronomy and then we'll also read, but let's begin with Exodus and then we'll go to Deuteronomy and then we'll come to the New Testament. Exodus chapter 21. Now in Exodus chapter 21 it's dealing with the laws about slaves. It's dealing with laws about slaves, but we see a principle there, even though it's in relation to slaves, but it's universally applicable. And when you get to verse 10 and verse 11, it says, that's a slave woman who's married, it says, if he takes another wife to himself, he should not dismiss her, he should not diminish her food, her clothing, for her marital rights. And if it does not do these three things for her, she shall go out for nothing without payment of money. Now, already you are seeing there that even though it has to do with a slave woman, there are rights that this married woman had. And those rights were that the husband had to provide food, clothing and also marital rights Now when we get to Deuteronomy 24 and you know Deuteronomy is referred to as the second law they are about to enter the promised land and again Moses gives them the law that God had given to him Deuteronomy chapter 24 When a man takes a wife and marries her, if then she finds no favour in his eyes because he has found some indecency in her and he writes her a certificate of divorce and puts it in her hand and sends her out of his house and she departs out of his house and if she goes and becomes another man's wife and the latter hates her and writes her a certificate of divorce and puts it in her hand and sends her out of his house. For if the latter man dies, who took her to be his wife, then the former husband who sent her away may not take her again to be his wife after she has been defiled. For this is an abomination before the Lord, and you shall not bring sin upon the land that the Lord your God is giving you for inheritance. Now when we get to Deuteronomy, it is this passage in Deuteronomy 4 that the Pharisees in Matthew chapter 19 and then the Lord Jesus Christ in Matthew 5 is making reference to. Now we need to be very clear and read what Christ is saying within its immediate and wider context. Now what the Lord Jesus Christ is saying in Matthew chapter 5 verse 31 and 32, he is trying to show the Pharisees and his audience that he did not come to abolish the law. And so, even this permission that Moses granted here, the Lord Jesus Christ did not come to abolish. Now when it comes to Matthew 19, he is responding to the question that was asked by the Pharisees. And the Pharisees actually saying, Before we get to the question, but just quickly, there were two divisions in understanding what Deuteronomy 24 is about. This aspect of something indecent in her. Others would, one school of thought was that you can divorce your wife for any reason. If you are not happy with her, leave her. Then there was another school that was saying, no, this something indecent in her is a reference to sexual immorality and a pattern, if that's a pattern of any kind of sexual immorality, then the man was free to divorce her. Now when we come to Matthew 19, bear in mind the Pharisees are asking the Lord Jesus Christ a question in reference to Deuteronomy 24. And the Bible tells us it was a test. So they are basically trying to see where is Christ? Is this with this group or with this group? And then the Lord Jesus Christ does not immediately answer, but takes them back to what God's plan has always been for Mary. But then the Pharisees say, but how come Moses commanded us? And Christ is saying, Moses did not command, but he permitted. And the reason is because of the hardness of your heart. And then Christ now explains how to understand Deuteronomy 24 verse 1 to 4. That the ground in which divorce can occur, according to what Christ is teaching, is sexual immorality. What Christ refers to as sexual immorality is unrepentant patterns that keep on repeating themselves. Now that becomes a violation of the marriage covenant. So it's not simply like Elder Botha did say that even in that case there is permission But that should not be the first line of defense. The first line of defense is reconciliation. But where it becomes clear that there's unrepentant patterns of sin, and that sin continues to show itself in any kind of sexual morality, then the offended party has the right to divorce. If I may add on, in this matter of Matthew 19 and Matthew 5, and Pastor Taylor has put it very, very well, that you ought to look at the context in which these passages are being spoken about, especially Matthew 19, but look back also at the wider context, where does it come from. So in other words, follow the lead, because some have suggested that what the Lord Jesus Christ is dealing with here is a matter of engagement, or what's called the betrothal view. In other words, these people were not married, they were engaged to be married, that's what he was answering, and saying you could therefore divorce if there is promiscuity, that's the word actually, or sexual sin, consistent sexual sin. But if you follow the lead, The crowd that the Lord is speaking to asks him a question about actual marriage. Just read it there. Matthew 19, verse 3. And Pharisees came up to him, tested him by saying, Is it lawful to divorce one's wife for any fault? Now there, some are suggesting he's talking about engagement or betrothal. But when he answers, they then say, Why did Moses command this, give a certificate of divorce and you're fine. If you go back to Deuteronomy as it shows, there Moses is talking about marriage. A man marries, puts away, then tries to marry someone else, puts away the certificate. He's not talking about engagement. He's talking about actual marriage, putting away. So that's what the Lord Jesus Christ is answering here. He's saying in this instance, a man is married. Moses permitted the divorce, and he permitted the divorce in this particular instance, what people call the exception clause. The particular verse is, because of the hardness of your heart, Moses allowed you to divorce your wife, but from the beginning it's not so. And I say to you, whoever divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality. and marries another, commits adultery. Now there the Lord gives that permission, or Moses, if you like, gave that permission. Marital unfaithfulness, sexual immorality. And the word that suggests it is more promiscuity. In other words, you have a constant pattern, or this is what you do. It's not you commit adultery once and therefore your wife or your husband must divorce you. In that instance, I think the Bible teaches that there should be an act towards reconciliation, towards forgiveness if the person seeks that forgiveness. Quite often we've had members approach us and speak about the matter of my husband has been unfaithful or my wife has been unfaithful and I should therefore divorce. My first reaction is that, but surely if you think about your own life and how you relate to the Lord, Can you say that your husband or your wife has treated you worse than you have treated the Lord in your relationship to Him? And the answer is obviously no. But the Lord forgave you. When you asked Him for forgiveness of all those things that you did, He forgave you. Now this person has committed adultery once, maybe even twice. And the first reaction is to leave. No, no. The first reaction should be, what is the Lord's example? Forgive them. seek the higher ground, that's what the Lord said, forgiveness. But if that is not possible because of circumstances, maybe because of practice, then the Lord said, except for sexual immorality, in that instance, or in instances, you may divorce and that divorce becomes legitimate. That's the first one. But the second one we see, I think, is in 1 Corinthians 7, and that's rather more clear. I think there's not much debate about that one. But if their believing partner separates or divorces, let it be so. In such cases, the brother or the sister is not enslaved. Now, in this instance, he's speaking about a Christian that's married to a non-Christian. And the non-Christian chooses to leave, or to separate, or to divorce, or to walk away from the marriage. and most usually it is for the reason that you are a Christian and I can't live with your principles. But whatever the reason might be, the non-Christian chooses to leave. He says in this instance, the brother or the sister is free. He is released from that marriage bond and in that instance, he is released to carry on with their lives, including the matter of remarrying, but only in the law that we shall probably see later. And then there is the third one, which also is very, very straightforward, and I think it's Romans 7. Yeah, Romans 7. And that's verse 2, and that's very, very straightforward. I think there's also no debate about that. Here he's speaking about the law, and the apostle Paul is speaking about the law, and he's making an analogy. But in verse 2 he says this, For a married woman is bound by law to her husband while he lives. But if her husband dies, she's released from the law of marriage. And if she's released, therefore she's free to proceed, to go and remarry. So, divorce in the matter of sexual immorality, divorce in the matter of a non-Christian walking away from the marriage, and there's no possibility to come back and reconcile. The person is allowed legitimate divorce. We also need to bear in mind that when we look at Matthew 19, the Lord Jesus Christ is not giving a comprehensive teaching on divorce, but is actually responding to a question raised by the Pharisees, and the context we've already seen is in Deuteronomy 24. That's why when the border takes us to First Corinthians 7, Paul and Christ are not in conflict because they are all looking at the Old Testament teaching on this aspect of marriage and then in Christ's case, he's responding to a question that has been raised And so it gives them the right interpretation of Deuteronomy 24. And then also Paul is amplifying failure in Deuteronomy 24. He is saying, okay, there is this aspect of marital unfaithfulness, but there is also this aspect of abandonment. And abandonment can also be in many forms. And probably maybe we'll also look at that. So there's marital unfaithfulness. There's also the aspect of abandonment. And abandonment is the violation of the marriage covenant that one makes and then willfully and intentionally breaks those vows that they've made. I think let me add very briefly. an important observation also that must be upon our minds when looking at this issue. The Lord Jesus Christ came to teach us the way of righteousness. And what was happening in the case that's spoken about in Deuteronomy was that the menfolk especially were unrighteously treating the womenfolk in the community. In most human societies, especially most economic and social relations, tend to be skewed against women. And the men were taking gross advantage of that. In fact, the issuance of a certificate of divorce was an act to protect the women. Because how else could a woman prove that she has been divorced? Because if she went and got married, or if her husband just put her off and she was found with another man, she would be guilty of committing adultery. And she would be stoned for that. And so the Lord was being gracious in saying, if in the hardness of your heart you reach to this state, be gracious, do this. But the parallel to that, which I want to bring forth about the graciousness of God, is when the Lord Jesus Christ teaches in John chapter 8 over the woman caught in adultery. He brings a very, very important principle there, which if you apply that principle to marriage, you will find hardly the same situation in here where all the men who brought this woman walked away. Because if the Lord was then to say, fine, Moses allowed you to put off your wife, whether it's infidelity or the phrase used is is indecency. And he was suggesting that you are decent yourselves. If you apply the same principle, even today the case of that of the water is talking about, you will discover that what the Lord Jesus Christ is actually teaching us here is a principle of righteousness. And as I said at the beginning, one of the things we want to see through and through in the institution of marriage is the revelation of the nature, the revelation of the character of God. And as we proceed, I hope you will see that in the efforts that we make as eldership, what we are trying to do is to bring forth the character of God and how it must impact upon our life, even in circumstances where we may be offended. And that is why the elders are saying, even in cases where there has been adultery, if there is no command to go ahead and divorce, I think and I hope we will see that more and more as we proceed with the study. Before I lose the thought, that's very important. Many people don't read Hosea or don't think about the book of Hosea and yet Hosea chapter 1, chapter 2 and chapter 3 is quite an impassioned plea about the Lord saying, I have married a nation, I am the husband, they are the wife, they have committed various adulteries and sins against me, but go out and seek them. And then in chapter 3, he actually redeems them back. So he doesn't divorce them. When they come to their senses and turn away from their sins, he takes them back. And that's the forgiveness that we're speaking about. The Lord, in the first instance, is saying, do not go the route of divorce. of forgiveness as far as that is possible. I think we cannot stress this enough. In spite of the fact that we speak about the exception clauses and that there is permission or allowance to divorce and therefore remarry, but we cannot stress enough that the Lord's first instance and the glory of God is portrayed much more if the world will ever hear that my wife or my husband committed adultery and was actually caught once or twice, and yet when they came back I forgave them, the world will wonder what kind of love is this. It can only be the love of God, because what the world does is, the first instinct, put away, marry somebody else or do something else. But if you were to forgive and follow the line of Christ, the world will wonder And we'll turn to the Lord by that testimony. The issue of an adulterous life has come out as one of the grounds, but maybe you can also ask the Lord to see whether a situation where there is extreme violence, how is that treated as well? Where the life of an individual is at stake. How do we treat such a situation? The passage that Elder Botha referred to in 1 Corinthians 7 and verse 15, that's how he talks of abandonment. Now, abandonment, it can be an actual leaving, or here's a person in the home, or a spouse in the home, who chooses to willfully and intentionally withholds privileges for rights due to a spouse. So that could be physical provision of material things. We also saw that in Exodus 21. Or it could be the emotional provision due to a spouse. Now, abuse is a willful intention to create pain or harm to an individual. Now, already, in the marriage bond, the vows, abuse is not one of them. Now, when we are making those vows, and really we see the provision in the scriptures, it's one we are saying, there will be this mutual provision for one another, in terms of the material aspect, there would also be the aspect of protection and there would also be the marital rights. Now where one is constantly being abused, there is already abandonment even though they are together because there is no provision of protection, there is no provision of emotional support, due to a spouse, there is no provision in that sense of material support due to the spouse. And we saw that in Exodus 21, the laws to do with a slave. But which is also inversely applicable in women in the marriage, is that when these three are not present, the aspect of marital rights The aspect of abandonment of maritime festivities will be drowned. Because we see that abandonment has a lot more also to do with just someone living. But it's also, are they providing? the emotional support due to a spouse, or even the physical support, or even the marital rights. Now, where your life is constantly under threat, already the marriage bonds of vows have been broken, because you are withholding that privilege from your spouse. either because of the position that you have as the Medicare provider, the sole winner in your home, or also what Dr. Safia says that in the Jewish pastoral, sadly women were treated as property of men so a man could divorce and when the second marriage has not worked he would say I'm going back to my wife and that's why there was that aspect of a bill of divorce it was to protect the women but also to protect the offended part of the soul even in the case of an abusive marriage our first reaction will not be end the marriage is to work on reconciliation and try and help them see what marriage is about and try and take them back to the vows they made on that day and begin to work through that but where it becomes clear that there are patterns of unrepentant sin and abuse is one of those, then we can use the clause in 1 Corinthians 7 that this spouse was long abandoned by their partner or their spouse. So having looked at the ground, I will now still ask the same question I asked, is there a place for remarriage? Yes, I think we've shown that quite clearly from tackling the issues of the reasons for divorce. There is a place for remarriage, but there is also a place where the scripture says there is no place for remarriage. And maybe just to summarize it, because we've taken time to speak about that, It is this, where there is legitimate grounds of divorce, which has been covered quite extensively, not maybe in totality, but quite extensively, where there is legitimate grounds of divorce, and that can be shown. In other words, in God's eyes, the marriage is dissolved, biblically speaking, allowed to be dissolved. In the eyes of the law of the land, the marriage is allowed to be dissolved. In that case, there is position to remarriage for the innocent party. Where there is no legitimate biblical ground for that, in other words, in God's eyes, whether you are separated with your husband or your wife, but in God's eyes, it's not right. That divorce is not correct. Otherwise, for any and every reason of Matthew 19, there is no ground for remarriage and it should not be allowed. And again, let me hasten to add and stress the matter that we've dealt with as elders because we've had these situations in our church and in other churches. We have taken strenuous measures, strenuous pains to first determine whether there is legitimate ground for biblical divorce in the manner that we've described. So if you're a member of our church, or both of you are members of our church, we have had oversight with you, we've visited with you, we've investigated, we've had witnesses come, we've got testimonies, and we see, is there legitimate grounds for divorce? Is there no opportunity for forgiveness? If one of you is a member of another church or you're coming in from another church and you therefore seek to remarry, we've taken pains to visit the elders of where you're coming from and speak to them and anyone else who may be involved, including the spouse who may be the other side, to speak about and find out whether there is legitimate ground for biblical divorce. And if there is, then we speak about remarriage and the council. Well, the vote has already alluded to your question, has already answered your question. And we do acknowledge that there are others that hold the feminine's view that even in this case where there are legitimate grounds, there must be no remarriage. And we respect their views, but As Elder Shafi'i at KFBC was saying, where we have legitimate biblical ground as we see in the scriptures, the innocent or the offended party is allowed to remarry. And the one who is the guilty party, to show the seriousness of what they've done or the fact that they've broken the marriage vows, they are not allowed. to marry. That's why when you look at Matthew 19, it says, except for sexual morality, there's a clause that is used. It's a man putting away the wife. If he puts away the wife on any other grounds except sexual morality, those grounds are not biblical. So both of them are reconciled or the offended party is free in the eyes of the law and in the eyes of the law of the land to remain. But the man who is in the act of putting away the wife, if the grounds are not biblical, that man must remain in that state till he dies. That just shows the seriousness of taking the marriage bond lightly. And you see that when you go to Malacca, when you go to Deuteronomy 24 and Malacca 2, It's actually the Bible telling us, if a man just hates the wife, he's just fed up of this woman, there's no biblical ground, they just don't like the woman. The man must remain in that state, or otherwise If he gets into another marriage, that's a marriage as an adulterous one. Why? Because the first marriage in the eyes of God is still valid. Because there are no biblical grounds to that issue. So that just shows us the seriousness of the marriage vows that we make before God and before the witnesses present. I think I could also add here further that When a marriage reaches a point where, for instance, there is persistent presence of violence, perhaps usually it will be a man against his wife, and normally what you find is women will be reluctant to want to take extreme action against the man, but I think I want to refer the members to the life of the Apostle Paul. Especially if you go to, you may not need to turn it to it here, Acts 16, starting around verse 25, Paul shows the use of his rights as a Roman citizen. Now, a lot of women often do not want to use those rights. For instance, to have a husband who is violent, incarcerated. And the reason comes back to social factors because perhaps the husband is the only breadwinner. But I think what is also, I mean what is possible, what we should be considering about in cases like that is that sometimes it's not a failure in an individual home, it's a failure of us collectively to provide safety nets for women who are in such situations. So this woman knows that if this man is arrested, even though he is a violent beast in the house, if he is arrested, what is going to happen to the children's school fees, the rentals and everything else and so on, because she cannot look to the rest of the Christian family for support. So, yes, there are cases where you therefore find that the grounds might be evident, but people are reluctant to go ahead because they cannot find guarantees among us that we are going to help them to carry the burdens of life as we are commanded to carry each other's burdens. So I think let's not just be, you know, let's not be like the man who brought the woman caught in adultery to the law. Let's also remember our own obligations towards one another, especially those among us, the women, who may find themselves in circumstances of the nature that we are talking about, that we may have to be part and parcel of the disciplinary process or the processes that help the elders to manage these situations. If the women were assured of some of those things, probably they would be in a much better position. But this is why also we insist that let everyone be able to work with their own hands, be able to at least sustain a livelihood of one kind or another because sometimes it's extreme dependence. That takes a women's vote to go into such circumstances. At this particular time, if anyone in the audience has a question... She was already waiting. Okay, so that means... I'm hearing a bit late, so I'm wondering if my question is covered. So what I heard from the Jewish background is to do with the men is to do with the women. But we are now in the Y2K age where women have taken to the liberation. We have a working woman and we have a man who has to take care of the children. This woman has become a great leader in the house. So what she does is she emotionally blackmails the man. This is in a marriage situation. It's hypothetical. I don't know if it's happened before in marriage. So, this woman, this woman in this marriage according to what Justice Wallace said, is not offering emotional support. Then she is also not offering to mention something about marriage rights. This should happen. You should not have a blind eye to it. It may not happen in this church, it's happening in the world. So if this woman is the one doing that, and she puts the husband away, She said, I don't want to. You're only working. But when they got married, maybe you were working, maybe you had a good job, and whatever. If she does that, is this grounds for divorce? Is there room for reconciliation? If this woman is not doing anything, I want to have nothing to do with this woman. Is this grounds for divorce? If there's no room for reconciliation on her part, what happens? Can this man resign? was the biblical grounds for both male and female, or husband and wife rather. We said in Mark 19 there was a context and its reference to the Jewish sort of pastoral. Now when you go to Mark 10, still the same question raised, But in chapter 11, it says, and he said to them, whoever divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery against her. And if she divorces her husband and marries another, she commits adultery. Now Mark is actually saying, even if it's a woman. But again, when you look at the context, the teaching of the Lord Jesus Christ still remains on divorce. If these are not biblical grounds, whether it's from the man or the woman, divorce is not allowed and the marriage will not take place. So whether it's a woman not giving her marriage rights to her husband, there's still ground. Only that men are reluctant to go to courts, you know, and to divorce my wife. Some of you, you know, we can work these things out. But it's applicable to a husband or a wife. Yeah, just know if you're doing that, we shall excommunicate you, there's no question. Don't do that. We shall. But just to be clear again, I think by some level we're discussing it, mentioned the term, Let the congregation be clear, the elders are not, first of all, judges, because we tend to be seen as judges. The minute you arrive, judge the person, and then you seek to discipline them. The elders are not, first and foremost, judges. They are, first and foremost, counsellors, seeking to win your heart and the heart of the other person to the Lord. And part of that is reconciliation, as far as that process takes us. And if we fail at that stage, then we move to what would be the next stage. So it's not, first of all, judging you. It's to counsel you, to find out are you on firm ground, spiritual ground, the both of you. And if you are not, it's to take you persistently, patiently through the scriptures to show you what is the right position. And then only if that fails, do we move to the next stage. I think that must be stressed. It's not willy-nilly. With you of marriage, the marriage as it was, even a man in form of a spiritual being will not have life in a clear way, like this is it, and walking in this is the straight and narrow way. And I just wanted that to be pointed out because I tend to think it was in the realm of themes of the horror, or what the author would call... So, I'm just thinking. I like what my friends have been saying, there are some people that want to do that as well. And for example, as I can remember, it always gives them to fall or to err on the side of caution than on the other side. That's what I wanted to say. Yes, just to comment on that, it is true. Professor Swayle mentioned it. We're not all agreed on the matters. We've never ever said we'll all be agreed on any and every single matter. We were. It doesn't fall in the matter that they are poor, not this one anyway. But we're not all agreed. However, in our research and discussion, as we said, we had the elders die. So we called all the Reformed Baptist churches that would come. And they came. And we spent a day and a half. We came up to these positions. But we also agreed that the many others who are Reformed Baptists don't necessarily believe this view. Some believe, as we call it, the permanence view. For information, next year we have for our annual conferences, one of the main speakers is Dr. John Piper. And Dr. John Piper, he believes in the permanent view. We don't agree together on this matter, but he's a reform doctor. And we don't all agree on the views in this instance all together, but we consulted one another, we prayed to the Lord, we sought with our brethren and consulted our brethren. We've also, when we were coming to this meeting, had a look at the number of Reformed Baptists across the world. What is their view on this matter? We were encouraging the fact that most of their view is what we are holding on to. Not everybody, but most of the views that we saw is what we hold on to. But we are cognizant of the fact that not everybody agrees in this way. And the elders will be giving their concluding remarks. I think I would love that they take into consideration the situation where, let's say someone came with a past, he wasn't a Christian, he divorced, where he was coming from as a non-Christian, he becomes a Christian, how is such a situation considered? And also, here is another situation where a person who is married, deserts the wife, goes and gets married to another person, they start up a life, and then in the process, this person realizes they have sinned against God, but they are in another, they have made another family, and then they feel compelled that they need to get back to their first wife. How is such treated? All right. Just quickly to respond to that, and if there are any other questions, please send them through and the next time we meet, maybe we could begin responding to your questions. Now in 1 Corinthians 7, when you read all of it, you actually see Paul also encouraging the Corinthians and all of us that each one must remain in the state in which God found them. So if by the time I'm divorcing my wife, I'm not a Christian, and then I'm saved, My current state is that of in my second marriage. Though I did that in ignorance and God demands that my current situation must believe in faithfulness and righteousness to Him. So, going to the second scenario, divorcing my second wife as it were, doesn't make it right. But I'm commanded to live faithfully in that second marriage. So I cannot go now and say, okay look, I've now understood what the Bible teach, so this lady, this wife of mine I'm leaving her to go back to my first wife. and this is what Paul is trying to teach and also in that is what Christ was trying to teach us and that's what Deuteronomy is teaching us Deuteronomy 24 is saying the first wife or the first husband rather has no rights when he has divorced the wife So even if the wife gets married and the husband dies, or she is divorced even in her second marriage, she cannot go back to the first husband or the first husband cannot come to her. Now, what we need to realize is the state in which God finds us and saves us, it is in that state we must remain. Even in the case, to stretch it further, where I have four wives, That's the state God found me in. I should proper wisdom to handle the situation. But one thing that is clear, I cannot be an elder in the Church of the Lord Jesus Christ, because I'm not a husband of that one wife. I think for me, maybe one of my concluding remarks, concluding thoughts, is that I notice that there's an unhealthy preoccupation with the subject of marriage, as against the real issue, which is the person of God. I think if you recall from what I said in the beginning, that through this institution, God intends to reveal himself to us. You will discover, for instance, as we cancel young couples getting married, that the marriage typifies the relationship covenant relationship. For instance, for a husband, I always tell the young people that I counsel, that reach the point of loving your wife as Christ has loved the Church, and then come and tell me you want to divorce her. Reflect on KBT. Reflect on yourself as a wife to Christ. And you will see what an impossible wife you are. You will see what an impossible church we are. Even small things like coming on time is a problem every time. And that is what God is drawing our attention to. To know what a gracious God He is. To know what a pardoning God He is. And He wants us to be like Him. So I think we have an unhealthy preoccupation on what is not the issue. We are holding on to the shell and not the gem that is inside there. Through our failings, through our frailties, which all of us have, God is drawing us to see who he is. I believe brethren, that if we focus on that, even the issue that Belinda is talking about here, that we have no common position. You will discover that actually the common position is there, because we all know how Christ loves the Church. Men may have different perceptions here and there, but we all know how Christ loves the Church. So I believe that let's take this opportunity to focus on this issue. But secondly also, we will have committed a lot of sins in our lives, in our marriages, against each other. In the eyes of God, who as the pastor said, is the one who instituted the marriage institution, there is none of those sins that is not forgiven. What we should seek is to draw men to repentance. What we should seek is to grow men to seek to glorify God through our relationships. I believe that if we can focus our minds and attention on the grace of God through our priorities, our marriages are going to work because God himself is the one who is going to sustain them. I sign out for now. Just two things in closing for me. And what he said is extremely important. And if you hold that foundation, we will be far better off in the way that we conduct ourselves in this area, in our church and elsewhere. Extremely important. But just remember, we have issues among us, and there will be issues still among us. In fact, Osambewe today is handling an issue in America of one of us who did exactly that. Abandoned and then married, and then now he's realizing he's wrong. Now what happens now? So we have issues among us. However, just remember that when we handle those issues and bring them to you as a church, it's very rare that we will bring every single detail of that issue to the fore, so that you understand when we are in public. So don't judge us by just coming here and saying, this one can remarry. We do due diligence, brethren. We pray, we cry, we try and convince. We threaten, we try and get to where he's speaking about. Before we get to the position where we are saying, yes, this is now legitimate and you can go ahead. We don't bring every single detail. But if you would like to hear the detail and you're not comfortable or sure about a particular issue, come and ask. And as far as is possible, without bringing the others into disrepute, we will bring details so your conscience is a little bit more clear. But it's very rare, in fact it never happens that we will say, you divorce and it's fine, or you remarry today and you just thought that last week. No. There's very serious and careful due diligence and prayer and consultation as well. The last thing I want to say is this, that we haven't done justice to you with a question and answer. Sure there's a lot of questions and answers. What we're conferring here quickly is what Emmanuel said. Please send in the questions, so that two weeks from now we deal with the questions first, Then we move to the next topic. I mean, for instance, that passage of, if you separate, you must remain unmarried. What does that mean? Does it mean if you are 19 years old, you keep waiting here whether the person has died or what? And then you marry. You know, those are the questions. So if you have those questions, bring them so that we tackle them first thing two weeks from now, and then we move on to what is the next topic. Thank you. Let's spread together. Our Father and our God, we thank you for the time given to us to be able to look at the issue of divorce and remarriage. Our Father, we confess that this is not an easy topic. But our grateful God that in all the different views that are held, there is something that we all agree to, is that marriage is a picture of the love of Christ for his church. And like we've been exalted and challenged and encouraged in our marriages, we must emulate the example of Christ. And we pray, O God, that you grant us much grace to bear with one another and to show your love for us that the world may see that what manner of love that you've given unto us, that we can be called children of God. And so we ask, O God, that even though, as we've seen, that because of the haggardness of hearts, there's that permission that, O God, that may our desire be reconciliation and to draw men and women to repentance. Father, we ask that you continue to work in our hearts. We know that so many questions that need to be tackled, that need to be looked at. There are situations or circumstances. We ask that as the questions are brought forth and into each time we meet again we pray for your grace and that the Holy Spirit will engrave the teachings upon our hearts. Be with us, O God, as we go into our family worship service. We pray again for our preacher this morning, Dr. Bokam. We ask that you use him mightily as you did last week in our meetings. Be with us, O God, and attend to our worship service for Jesus' sake. Amen.