All right, let's open our Bibles up to two places, James chapter number two and Romans chapter number four. Tonight we're going to step into the arena and we're gonna have a heavyweight bout between Paul and James. Tonight's message is James versus Paul or Paul versus James. And the last few weeks we showed some things regarding church age salvation. I think it's very clear when you read through Paul's epistles. You understand after the cross that a person has to put their faith in the Lord Jesus Christ and what he did on the cross. Making atonement for our sins and the fact that he was buried and rose again the third day from the dead. When a person, when a sinner puts their faith in Jesus, then their sins are forgiven and they're saved. Instantaneous. And so we went through a lot of verses on that in the last couple of messages, and tonight we're gonna go back and forth with James chapter two and Romans chapter number four, and we're gonna battle it out with James and Paul here. And we'll go ahead and start in Romans chapter number four with Paul. Verse number one. Romans 4, one. What shall we say then that Abraham, our father, as pertaining to the flesh, hath found? For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory, but not before God. For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness. Now to him that worketh is a reward not reckoned of grace, but of death. but to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness. And we'll stop there. And you'll come down, if you will, to verse number nine. He mentions how the blessing goes to us as well. He says in verse nine, cometh this blessedness then upon the circumcision only or upon the uncircumcision also. For we say that faith was reckoned, to reckon is to account, was reckoned to Abraham for righteousness. How was it then reckoned? When he was in circumcision or in uncircumcision. Not in circumcision, but in uncircumcision. So what Paul's referring to, if you have a reference in your Bible, you should have Genesis 15 there. In verse number three, when Abraham believed God and God gave him righteousness, that was Genesis chapter 15, before Abraham was ever circumcised. And so what he's saying is, look, Paul's a Jew, but he's preaching to Jews and Gentiles after the cross. And he's like, look, Abraham, this thing about Abraham being given righteousness by faith had nothing to do with a Jewish rite of circumcision. It had everything to do with God giving him righteousness because he believed what God told him. And that's the point. And that's how Abraham's salvation is a type of ours. We believe what God told us and he gives us imputed righteousness by faith. Now let's go to James chapter, and keep your hand there, we may come back, but go to James chapter number two. Let's look at what we see here because it seems to go completely contrary to Paul's words. James chapter number two. We'll come down to verse 14. James chapter two, begin in 14. What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say that he hath faith and have not works? Can faith save him? If a brother or sister be naked and destitute of daily food, and one of you say unto them, depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled, notwithstanding you give them not those things which are needful to the body, what doth it profit? Even so, faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works. Show me thy faith without thy works, and I will show thee my faith by my works. Thou believest that there is one God, thou doest well. The devils also believe and tremble. But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead? Verse 21, was not Abraham our father justified by works when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar? Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect? And the scripture was fulfilled, which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness, and he was called the friend of God. You see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only. And we'll stop there. Now these two passages have been set aside ever since Christians have been debating back and forth about the Bible as two passages that seem to butt heads and go contrary to one another. I think I told you before how Martin Luther called James, he called it a right strawy epistle. Strawy, like pine straw, like straw, like stuff you burn. And the idea was that he struggled with it because Martin Luther, when he finally had the light turned on and he was converted, even though he came out of Catholicism, he was of the Augustinian order, but he got saved because he read Romans and he understood that salvation is a gift of God, not of works, like Ephesians 2, 8 and 9 tells us. So when he comes across James chapter number two, Man, Romans 4 says, hey, Abraham's justified by faith. James 2 says, don't you know Abraham's not justified by faith only? He's justified by works. As a matter of fact, if you've ever done any witnessing and you've come across some people that don't believe you're saved by grace through faith, they will use James chapter number two. I have several times have talked to people. Most of the cults, like your Mormons and Jehovah's Witness, they'll run to James chapter two real fast. to try to prove that you're not saved by faith only, that you have to have works. Now these two, like I said, you can see, I think it's pretty clear. We just read them, you can kind of see how these things seem to butt heads. Okay, so I don't have to keep belaboring that point. Now this, what we're gonna look at tonight and then next couple of Wednesdays, we're gonna look at some things in Hebrews and then also in the other transition epistles. We're going to show how Paul's epistles seem to say one thing and these other passages seem to say another thing. I may even do a message called Paul versus Jesus. And I'll go into all that and explain that. This is Paul versus James. But when we see these, there's a couple of different ways you can tackle it. And I want to give you the evangelical standard way that people tackle it. And this is how most of us think. Most of us judge everything in the light of our own experience, because we are the center of the universe. You are very important, aren't you? But unfortunately, we always see things from our perspective. The room is now spinning. You mean the room wasn't spinning? OK. But what happens is we see things from our perspective and the evangelical approach and most commentators, I'm gonna read you some in a minute, they see things on this other side of the cross. And so everything in the Bible has gotta be judged by our experience and how we're saved by grace through faith in Jesus Christ, even the Old Testament. And so what you'll have people do is they'll go even back to the Old Testament and try to read into the Old Testament people actually having faith in the coming Messiah and trusting Jesus and being saved by grace through faith without works. That's one way to do it. Another way to do it as we think about James is to say, okay, we're gonna look at James and view of this experience. James is writing on the other side of the cross. So we're on the other side of the cross. So James obviously is writing to Christians. And so we have to reconcile these things. So James knows that you're only saved by grace through faith in the finished work of Jesus Christ. So there must be another way to read this passage. Okay, and that's the evangelical approach. Here's my approach. My approach is, my presupposition is not that salvation is always by grace through faith in the finished work of Christ. That's not my presupposition. My presupposition is the Bible is true how it says it, where it, whatever it says. Deuteronomy chapter six verse 25, it shall be our righteousness if we observe to do all those things that's written therein. Ezekiel chapter 18, I gave you those verses a few weeks ago, I think we went to Ezekiel 18. That Old Testament saint, he had to have works in order to be a righteous person. Righteousness was not imputed to Old Testament saints. Righteousness was earned. All those verses in Psalms, David says, judge me according to my integrity. Search me, oh God, and see if there's any wicked way in me. According to the cleanness of my hands will he recompense me. I'm not praying that. Lord, you judge me based on Jesus Christ. Don't judge me on my works, I'll fall. And so, I take the presupposition the Bible's true how it says it just like it is, even if it goes against my own idea. But that's not the evangelical approach. And I'm gonna read you some things here. And this is what happens. Basically, you have three ways to look at these problem passages. We're gonna look at Paul versus James. We'll look at Paul versus the transition epistles. We'll look at Paul versus Jesus. And here's three ways to look at it. Number one, you can look at it like a Calvinist would look at it. A Calvinist would say eternal security is in every age, Old Testament, New Testament. Once a person puts their faith in the Old Testament and the coming Messiah, they're saved by grace through the faith in the finished work of Christ, even though Christ hasn't shed his blood, and so they have eternal salvation. And the fact that they live a good life just proves that they did have eternal salvation. Same thing in James chapter number two, your faith is proven by your works. So you supposedly make a profession of faith, you're in church for three years, you fizzle out, you don't go to church for the next 30 years of your life, you just never were saved to start with because you didn't have the works that backed up your profession. Now let me read you a couple things here. I'll start off with the Schofield Three. If you get a Schofield Bible that's still the King James, It's called a Schofield III. It's basically the new Schofield of 1967 and they went back and put the King James text in it even though the 67 took the King James text out. And so they have kind of put some different notes and things and it's not just the old Schofield notes, it's the Schofield notes from People like Charles Ryrie and Walvoord and J. Dwight Pentecost and those guys. And here's their note on justification by faith, if I can read it without my goggles. Man, I'm gonna have to have glasses. See, I got my giant print Bible. Let me borrow her female glasses. Just don't tell anybody. Yours might be too powerful. That looks like I could read from something on the moon from those. All right, let's see, for James, well, I'll start with the paragraph. Moreover, the word justify is for Paul a legal positional term describing a once for all act of God appropriated by faith alone and relating to the initial moment of the Christian life. But for James, justify is employed of any subsequent moment of the Christian life and proves the reality of a man's faith before his fellow men. So what you want to get out of that is they're saying that what James is talking about, justified by faith, just proves the reality of a man's faith. That's what I just told you. In other words, if you're really saved, then you're going to have good works, and it's going to back up that you really were saved to start with. That's the standard interpretation. That's the scholarly way to say it. I'll give you another guy. This is John MacArthur, very popular Calvinist personality, evangelical. He very strongly preaches lordship salvation. He's quoting James 2.14, not in the King James obviously. In the phrase, if a man says he has faith and not works, the verbs are present tense. They describe someone who routinely claims to be a believer, yet continuously lacks any external evidence of faith. And so he goes down and he talks about faith and the context is saving faith. Where there are no works, we must assume no faith exists either. Now let's just take this to the logical conclusion, you know, ten years from now when you can't attend church anymore and you're at home because you're bedridden and you quit reading your Bible and you watch soap operas all day. I used to get on to a guy at the nursing home, I was joking with him, he was blind, he was autistic, and I'd get on to him for, he watched the bold and the beautiful. I said, Dewey, don't you be watching the bold and the beautiful, and he would, you know, he can't see nothing, you know. But the idea is, okay, what is that? That is actually Calvinism. I'm about to give you a quote from Calvin, and it's actually in this Bible, some of you may have this one, it's called the King James Study Bible. And this is their note. You think, man, oh, this would be a good Bible to get. It says King James Study Bible. Yeah, well, who's putting the notes in there? Some of them are dispensational scholars, but it sure doesn't sound very good here. James 2, 14 to 17, if you go through the whole thing, it talks about Paul, and he actually quotes Luther too. Luther called this epistle strawly, because it emphasized works too much, because Luther couldn't reconcile it. For Paul, justification by faith, kind of like what they said in the other. James retorts that the kind of faith that does not produce works is not saving faith. As Calvin said, John Calvin, as in Calvinism. Faith alone saves, but a faith that saves is never alone. That's a very common quotation you hear a lot of time from reformed authors. And it's kind of like one of those little cliches that sounds good. You're saved by faith alone, but not by a faith that is alone. If you don't have enduring, you say, well, Presbyterians, you know, they're kind of like us because they believe in eternal security. Okay, do you know why they believe in eternal security? It's called perseverance of the saints. And when you begin to read what all the scholars say, the reason they believe in eternal security is if you truly are saved, you will persevere. It's not God keeping you saved, it's you keeping yourself saved. They start off going all the way contrary to Arminians, which teach you have to have works or you're gonna lose your salvation, into saying in the end, if you don't have produced good works, you never were saved to begin with. So we have a couple of different options. Here's the first option, it's Calvinism. It says, okay, if you have saving faith, then you will produce good works. Then you have Arminianism, and I just mentioned that. That comes from a fellow named Jacob Arminius, and he believed, and as there are folks down further in church history, the Wesleyans, you've heard of John Wesley, and Nazarenes, and folks like that, they believe you can lose your salvation. Assembly of God, Church of God, a lot of non-denominational groups, a lot of your Calvary chapels. In other words, if you don't continue to come to church, read your Bible, witness, tithe, do what you're supposed to do, live right, then you lose your salvation. That's the Arminian position. Saints in any age can lose their salvation. Old Testament, New Testament, Tribulation, wherever. Now here's what I believe is the right position, the Bible position. There are saints in other ages that could lose their salvation. And I'll give you a couple of examples. One of them, if salvation can be equated with the Holy Spirit, which I believe the salvation work that's done on the spirit of man is the Holy Spirit doing the work. In the Old Testament, Saul, the Bible says the spirit of the Lord departed from Saul. Samson, the Bible says the spirit of the Lord departed from Samson. David prayed after he committed two unpardonable sins. He said, I pray they take not thy Holy Spirit from me. And so that's Old Testament. And even scholars that don't believe what I'm telling you, they will admit that the work of the Holy Spirit was different in the Old Testament and saints were not sealed. Well, how can somebody have eternal security if they're not sealed? The Bible says we're sealed into the day of redemption, which is the rapture. The Bible says we have the earnest of our inheritance. So we have a down payment on the inheritance. We have a sealing work that the Holy Spirit performs that keeps us saved. Now in the tribulation, that's not evident either because in the tribulation, if somebody takes the mark of the beast, they don't have salvation anymore. And we'll talk about those verses when we get into some passages in Hebrews and Revelation. So those are the three positions and these are three views. Now let's talk about Romans versus James real quick. Romans chapter four, he says in verse number three, Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness. And I mentioned Genesis 15 was where that was at. So let's just compare these two. Here's Romans. Paul's talking about Genesis 15. Genesis 15, God says, Abraham, come here. And he says, look up at the stars. You go out there, and you look up there, and without light pollution, you can see a lot. He says, you see all those stars? He says, yeah. I'm going to give you that many kids. And after the Lord picked him up off the ground, No, it doesn't say that, it just says Abraham believed God. He believed what God told him, and the Bible says he imputed righteousness to Abraham. That's what Paul's referring to. James, what does he refer to? He refers to Genesis 22. Was not Abraham my father justified by works, verse 21 of James 2, when he offered Isaac his son upon the altar? Two separate events. Paul's alluding to Genesis chapter 15, Abraham's simple belief in God. James chapter two is referring to Genesis 22, when Abraham's faith was tested and he went and he had to offer Isaac. James is referring to Genesis 22, Paul's referring to Genesis 15. Abraham believed God. What did Abraham do in Genesis 22? He offered Isaac. There wasn't any belief to it. He takes Isaac and ties him up. He picks the knife up. He's about to stab him. Romans is obviously addressed to the church age. Go back to James chapter number one. To me, this really is the linchpin to help you understand the right division of some of these transition books. Look in James chapter number one. And when I say a transition epistle, and I wanna make sure I say epistle, because there's a couple other transition books, but a transition epistle are these letters, just like you have James' letter, first, second, third John, Jude, first, second Peter, these are letters. A transition's moving from one position to a stage to a next, so you get in a transition. And so you're gonna have church age doctrine that are going to be in these transition epistles. This is where it gets a little bit confusing. Especially when you get in Hebrews, man, there's chock full of Church Age doctrine. You get in James, there's some great Church Age doctrine in the book of James. First John is the whole first chapter, completely Church Age applicable. First John 5.13, one of the greatest Church Age verses there are. And so there's going to be Church Age doctrine in these transitions, but when you go from the epistles, what you're in the book of Revelation, what you're doing, you're transitioning from the Church Age to the Great Tribulation. And so we see that here in James chapter one, look in verse number one. James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ to the 12 tribes, which are scattered abroad greeting. Now you need to notice who something's addressed to. It's against the law to go out to somebody's mailbox and grab mail addressed to somebody else and take it to your house. But Christians just go all through the Bible and take everybody else's mail. It's not addressed to you. Paul's a servant of Jesus Christ, and Paul says, I'm an apostle of the Gentiles. I magnify my office, he says. And Paul is our apostle. New Testament church age. And you want to get that. I mean, there are scholars that aren't even saved. I'm talking about unsaved religious scholars that write books on what I'm talking about tonight. Paul versus James. They can see it with their intellectual abilities. They can say, yep, that don't match. Oh, this don't match. I've got a whole book in my office on the problem passages of Hebrews. Say, well, I didn't think that was a problem. Don't you know there's a problem in Hebrews? But I've got a book on that and you've got the Armenians and the Calvinists going back and forth trying to reconcile the stuff instead of rightly dividing the word of truth. To me, the Bible's true just like it is. The problem is you can't try to force yourself in the wrong category. I'm not gonna put myself under the Old Testament. Why would I put myself in the tribulation? You know what they say about those passages and we'll get to them later and I'll quote some people too if you want that later on. You get out into the book of Revelation and you have these people that they love not their lives unto the death. You know, Revelation chapter 12, those that, you know, they have victory over the devil and they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, by the word of their testimony. They love not their lives unto the death. Well, the reason they endured to the end is because they were saved. If you are saved, you will endure to the end of the tribulation. That doesn't work too well with the consideration of the doctrine of backsliding. Because those people that say that, even some of the folks I've quoted, they will give in to a general conception of backsliding. Although if it just goes on a little bit further and further and further, let's say they might give in to, you know, you missed a couple of services, but it starts getting into two and three and four years and you hadn't been in church, they're gonna say, well, that person probably needs to check up on his salvation. Then if you can get them into a big homecoming service, you can have a retread service. You ever see the retreads they put on the tires? You get the whole church in there and you keep talking them out of their salvation, you can get the piano player saved. And maybe the preacher's wife. Look, I'm not doubting that occasionally those kind of things happen. Don't throw out the baby with the bathwater. There are people that sit in church for years and years and don't ever get saved. I understand that. But when you have these deals, I know how the preachers do it, man. They're great salesmen. They'll give an invitation that lasts 35 minutes. You sang 15 stanzas of Just As I Am. I go down to get saved just so I can go home and get something to eat. You ever seen them, man? The camp meeting preachers. You ought to watch them. I've been in the services where they take up the offering. Who can pledge $100? Come on, anybody got a $100 bill? $100 bill. I'm talking about a preacher. Getting somebody to raise his hand and they raise about $15,000 to try to pay for the meeting. Guilt, guilt, guilt, guilt, guilt, guilt, guilt, bondage, bondage, bondage, all that stuff is. And they don't even understand because they're about as deep as a mud puddle, they're preaching Calvinism. They're preaching lordship salvation. Well, if what you got won't get you back to church on Sunday night, what makes you think it's gonna get you to heaven? I don't even know where you can go with that, you know? It's like, okay. That's lordship salvation. If he's not lord of all, he's not lord at all. Sounds good, doesn't it? Is he lord of everything in your life? Come on now. Does he have your hobby, the best hobby that you have? Have you dedicated, have you given it to him? Does he have all your time? Does he have all of your pocketbooks? If there's been no change, there's no change. Look, there's an element of truth in all of these things. Jesus should be the Lord of your life. There should be change in your life. We are told as Christians by our Apostle Paul to produce good works. And I'm not saying you shouldn't check up. If you don't know that you're saved, you need to know that you know that you know that you're saved. There's elements of truth in all that, and that's why this becomes very dangerous. I have talked to people that have had family members and people in their close lives that have been affected by this, infected, I should say, by this kind of preaching, and it's Calvinism. Now, the Bible believing position, I believe, is that these verses are true as you find them. James is absolutely truthful, but notice he's alluding to Abraham when he offers up Isaac. Paul's dealing with Abraham when he believed God by faith. James is obviously dealing with a letter where he writes to the 12 tribes. Okay, so this is a letter. When you go to chapter number five, if you will, flip over there, I think James has some prophetic content to it. And I say that because chapter five has all these hints in it. Chapter five has a warning for people that make money for these riches are corrupted, verse number two. And in other words, there's the same emphasis you find in the Old Testament prophets, like in the book of Job and even in Psalms and some of those prophecies, where the rich are bad and the poor are righteous. Now, where are you gonna find that fit? It's not gonna fit in Solomon's day. Silver's like stones. Solomon's day is a time of prosperity because of righteousness. But what you'll find in Bible prophecy is there's coming a period on this earth to where when you serve God and you stand up for God, you won't be able to get any food. You won't be able to use your bank card. You won't have a mark like everybody else has. You won't have access to the global health account and the global budget and the global food. It's prophecy. Keep reading down here in James 5. Notice this thing about killing the poor and all those kind of things, 4, 5, 6. Be patient, verse 7, until the coming of the Lord. Behold, the husbandman waited for the precious fruit of the earth and had long patience for it until he received the early and latter rain. Joel chapter 2, Revelation chapter 14. That's the husbandman reaping the earth. We studied that in Sunday school. That's a second advent reference, not a rapture reference. Verse eight, be also patient, establish your hearts for the coming of the Lord, draw off nigh, grudge not one against another, brethren, lest ye be condemned. Behold, the judge standeth before the door. Take my brethren, the prophets, who have spoken in the name of the Lord for an example of suffering affliction and of patience. Revelation chapter two talks about the hour of patience, the time of patience. Revelation 12, this is the patience of the saints. Verse 11, behold, we count them happy which endure. Matthew 24, 13, he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. You have heard of the patience of Job. 42 chapters. There are 42 months in the Great Tribulation. The patience of Job and have seen the end of the Lord, the Lord is very pitiful and of tender mercies. so on and so forth. Look down at verse 17, Elias was a man subject to like passions as we are and he prayed earnestly that it might not rain and it rained not on the earth but the space of three years and six months. There is that three and a half year period of the Great Tribulation, 42 months, 1260 days and of course Elijah is one of the two witnesses in Revelation chapter number 11. So we have all kind of hints there in James chapter number five. So here's the deal. James refers to Genesis 22. Here's Abraham actually doing a work, offering up Isaac on the altar. His faith is proven. There's the element of truth with the whole Calvinist stuff. His faith is proven by his works. And his works justify him before God. His faith alone does not justify him before God. Your faith alone justifies you before God. God does not look at your works at all. He saves sinners in this age, no strings attached. A person could get saved in this age in five minutes and I've led at least three. Three people on their deathbed to Christ. Within weeks they died. Somebody could get saved and literally within the next few hours they could die with no good works at all to show for their salvation and they'd go to heaven in this age. No chance to justify themselves to do any good works to prove that they're really saved or truly saved. So we have James obviously offering Isaac, Abraham offers Isaac, Abraham believes God with Paul. James addresses those Jews, and I believe it's a prophetic reference to the tribulation. Paul is dealing with a spiritual type of church-age salvation. Abraham believes God. He doesn't believe the same thing we believe. You can't push the type all the way. The two types in Romans four, Abraham and David. And people always try to make salvation the same through all the testaments by using Abraham and David. Those are two great examples, but you can't push them all the way. Abraham didn't believe on the death, burial and resurrection of Christ. He didn't understand anything about that. He said, well, he received him in a figure and all this. Isaac's the type of Christ. We get all the types on this side, but you really think Abraham understood that? He looks up there and sees all those stars and he says, you gonna give me that many descendants? Okay, I believe that. That's what he believed. You believed on Jesus Christ hanging in your place, dying for your sins on the cross. He was buried, he came up from the dead. That justifies you. You believe two different things. Where's the comparison? The comparison is faith. You believe what God said by faith. Furthermore, let me say this when I have time to turn to it, but in Romans 4 and Romans 3 actually, Romans 3 more so, you know what you get? You don't just get righteousness, you get the righteousness of God. That only comes through Jesus Christ. Abraham was given imputed righteousness. He was not given the righteousness of God. It's a big difference. You say, why? Because the righteousness of God is only given after the death, burial, and resurrection of Christ because Jesus had to live a sinless life that was right and righteous. That's where that righteousness comes from. He lived a righteous life and he rises from the dead and he's able to impute that righteous life to us by faith. So he's a spiritual type of church age salvation. And who is Abraham? Well, Abraham in Genesis 22, guess what? He is circumcised. Genesis 15, he's not circumcised. So he's a great type picture for unbelieving Gentiles that receive Jesus Christ by faith, which is the predominant number of those who make up those in church age salvation. But here's Abraham, a circumcised Hebrew. A type picture of a physical type picture of the father of the Jews justified by works, not by faith only. It's faith and works. And so I think the Paul versus James is very clear. These are both separated by at least 17 years. Abraham is not justified by works in Genesis 15. Abraham is justified by works in Genesis 22. Really, I could have said that from the beginning and we could have went home. Paul and James are both right. but they're both drawing from a different application because doctrinally James is transitioning. This stuff is going out into the tribulation. That's why you have all that stuff there in chapter number five. That's why you have all that emphasis on works in James to the 12 tribes because faith does have to prove itself. You can have people say, yeah, I believe in Jesus. And then they get weak and they take the mark of the beast. They can say they believe in Jesus all day long, but if they don't have works and they don't endure and they don't prove their faith in the tribulation, it's no good. Every heresy is a truth misplaced. Or I should say most heresies are truth misplaced. And man, you get talking to these cults, they'll throw up Matthew 24, 13, he that shall endure unto the end. They'll go to James chapter number two, and they wanna stay over there in the gospels. They wanna deal with discipleship under Christ. You gotta forsake everything. If you've forsaken everything, well, you can't be his disciple. You can't be saved if you don't forsake everything. And we'll get into that some other time. So Abraham is not justified by works in Genesis 15. That's what Paul's talking about. It illustrates church age salvation. James is talking about Abraham being justified by works in Genesis 22, and he's dealing doctrinally with tribulation salvation. That's the best way to categorize it. So we have these two types. Paul is a spiritual type, showing Abraham's the father of all those who believe by faith. James gives the physical type, the father of the Jews justified by faith and works in the tribulation. And so that's James versus Paul.